Curse

Kakumei · Feb 10, 2007, 03:26 AM // 03:26

Because failure due to stupidity is a waste of time?

I thought this was understood. Who wants to go into a mission with a bunch of complete idiots with the worst skillbars imaginable? Some people don't have time to fail a mission over and over thanks to the ignorance of other players.

Divinus Stella · Feb 10, 2007, 03:50 AM // 03:50

Having a team full of people with no clue is actually good fun if your not in a hurry, if i want to grind thru a mission fast il take as many nuker heros as possible and go.

I do miss PUGs in pve, i think half of the reason prohpecies was so much fun is that i played it with other people rather than bots, which added an extra level to the gameplay, i think heros killed pve for the largest part.

Coloneh · Feb 10, 2007, 05:13 AM // 05:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Legendary Ultimatum

Because my idea of fun is not watching a monk using mending and spamming healing breeze, a Warrior aggroing every single mob in the area and a Elementalist spamming flare, if that's your idea of fun, then good for you, but I'm sure 80% of people that post here won't find that fun.

this is exactly right. people play for fun, not to watch groups gather 60 dp in 5 minutes and then ragequit.

Zinger314 · Feb 10, 2007, 05:19 AM // 05:19

Point of comment: This thread proves that I am not the only pessimist and elitist jerk in this community.

Anyways, when I pugged after NF release, I ask the W/Mos or anyone with questionable IQ to call out their skill-bar. I usually catch Mending or something stupid everytime.

(And yes, I suggest that the person adjust the build. But no, they are always stubborn...)

Calen The Civl · Feb 10, 2007, 06:53 AM // 06:53

When I want to actually complete a mission, I turn to either a good pug (the rare types that you know when you see em) or most often just hero/hench it.

When I want to have some fun and a little frustration, I monk for a random pug. Most of the time the pug makes it 75% of the way through the mission and then things go sour. Its rather funny to be the last one standing and having the group cheer me on despite the situation being impossible.

Other than to have some fun, I pug to help others learn to play better. Although I do agree with Zinger: too many players refuse to adjust builds.
If I can help one player become better after a pugging and have some fun myself then my time was not wasted.

HawkofStorms · Feb 10, 2007, 04:31 PM // 16:31

I just love the PUGs back in phrophecies. LF monk over and over again for like an hour in Borlis Pass mission. Some people really didn't understand that that part of the game was easy without a healer.

Antheus · Feb 10, 2007, 09:37 PM // 21:37

Failing DoA is normal and expected.

Failing Canthan Elite missions is a waste of time (proven builds, known tactics, etc.)

Failing regular missions is, well, insanely annoying. Especially because they are not hard.

You enter elite missions with very realistic expectation of failure at some very known points. But getting party wiped by a bunch of kournan scribes is frustrating.

About monks + flare. Ok, it doesn't really kill anyone. But still, a monk would contribute much more using some /N or /Me skills. Many of those can even return energy, deal damage or interrupt (all in one if possible), but above all, they don't burn monk's energy for measly flare or fire storm damage. The only thing worse is warrior with flare.

shadowmist · Feb 10, 2007, 11:02 PM // 23:02

Nobody likes losing, thus they take measures so as to not lose. It's not really rocket science, though I don't quite like it at times. It's something I expect pretty much whenever I join pug groups, and I save my more 'exotic' builds for my guildies to praise or put down.

I really like trying new builds out, but I also understand that other players might not like it if I bring a horrible build. I always test my builds out in certain situations before bringing them to pug enviroments, but I've noticed some other people not do this. They bring skills that cause unneeded hassle, which is frankly just annoying. There's nothing 'wrong' really about spamming flare or mending, but there's a lot better ways to acomplish the same things. Any good player will realize this themselves as they progress through the game, and you generally won't encounter them when you get to places that might require more than bad groups.

I really don't mind playing with non l33t players, as everyone does start off with very little knowledge. Most players will accept helpful criticism, and those that don't belong on ignore lists.

Captain Dingo · Feb 11, 2007, 12:45 AM // 00:45

I know what you mean, I've noticed this in what few pickup groups I've been a part of. And if any of them demand to know the exact build I'm using, I just leave the group. My experiences with that is that they then tell me my build could be better and they start criticizing and telling me to bring different skills.

The funny thing about this is 95% of the community hasn't played Mesmer as hardcore and as long as I have, so it's always amusing to hear their suggestions. "omg u dont hav phantasm?"

I'm Domination, sparky, I don't use Phantasm.

My only other issue with pickup groups is, as just hinted to, they never, ever seek Mesmers. Without me sounding too arrogant I hope, I do what I do exceedingly well, and it disheartens me when everyone's just looking for another "tank," "healer," or "nuker." The day I hear someone requesting a Mesmer's assistance will be the day people stop trading in the Local chat.

TechnoSword · Feb 11, 2007, 12:55 AM // 00:55

lol just played with a group right now, 11 guys, and im the only monk, *dont worry* they say, almost all of us have monk secondaries so we can take care of ourselves, just heal the non monk guys. So of course it starts, the only 2 rangers start setting up traps, by the door in which they retreat at, and then i tell them your trapping to far back, 1 person lures (level 19 whammo) and dredges come out of no where, 4 WTF's later and alot of bipping, me and the necro are the only survivors. el fin!

Sunchips · Feb 11, 2007, 01:28 AM // 01:28

ok, little confused here... PuG's? what's a PuG?

Captain Dingo · Feb 11, 2007, 01:53 AM // 01:53

It's a pickup group, usually meaning the kinds of groups you assemble at complete random with people you don't know for the purpose of completing a goal.

AKA the ones I avoid like the plague! I love the addition of heroes.

GloryFox · Feb 11, 2007, 04:21 AM // 04:21

Lets face it people are creatures of habit. For instance I did Urgoz today as a Splinter Weapon Barrage Ritualist. As soon as I began using splinter weapon with barrage half my first group rage quit because they have never seen the build before.

So we went back into town and gathered a new group and after a while people said "hey that’s a cool build...I’ve never seen that before and it seems to work well".

Now contrast the first group. The first group did not even give the build a chance the second who saw the build in action was less bothered by it and I had several PM's telling me how impressed they were at the damage output.

Fact is people are comfortable with what they are familiar with. This is one of the reasons why many good builds for HA get nerfed. People become creative and rather than come up with a good counter they cry and call for "skill balance" until they can run a build they know about and are familiar with.

Once people can get over there over hyped personal prejudice you can have some good PUG experiences. If you see someone with a good concept build for a simple PvE mission give them a chance you may learn something.

Phaern Majes · Feb 11, 2007, 04:40 AM // 04:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sunchips

ok, little confused here... PuG's? what's a PuG?

PuG= Pick up group. Just a group of random players banding together to steel themselves against the harsh elements and overwhelming odds set against them!

Err....just what you call any group you "randomly" join where you don't know the people you are playing with.

As for people dissing Healing Breeze shame on you. Its not a bad skill, the problem lies in how people make use of it not the skill itself. The skill is great for countering degen, or when you're running past a group and need a buff against the occasional damage. Its when people think healing breeze is a good skill to use right after some one gets nailed by say an aatxe. Healing breeze does not counter 250 damage every 2 seconds. However in the right situation, or even cast before the aggro it can help alot.

erfweiss · Feb 11, 2007, 07:31 AM // 07:31

I think the worst group I had this week was at FOW. A tank using flare, a whammo with mending, and the 2nd monk was afk for 20 minutes. Had to solo monk most of our time there. Actually got to the forgemaster like that.

Vermilion · Feb 11, 2007, 07:52 AM // 07:52

I haven't pugged in a long time, but generally I was open-minded in regards to builds because I run bad ones myself. All of Pve on my mesmer was using a full Dom/interrupt bar, blood necro, etc. I got masters on most Factions missions with no monk teams with whammos and the like, which goes to show how much the build doesn't really matter.

the_jos · Feb 11, 2007, 09:43 AM // 09:43

Quote:

But still, a monk would contribute much more using some /N or /Me skills. Many of those can even return energy, deal damage or interrupt (all in one if possible), but above all, they don't burn monk's energy for measly flare or fire storm damage.

/E has a couple of nice skills, Glyph of Lesser Energy being the most noticable.
I prefer this skill in most PvE builds I use.

Quote:

The day I hear someone requesting a Mesmer's assistance will be the day people stop trading in the Local chat.

It happened to me, but trading in local chat did not end.
I've seen several groups requesting mesmers in the Gate of Madness mission.
And help of my mesmer has been requested a few times (whisp from PuG leader).
On those occasions they wanted a specific role, so the PuG leader knew what he/she was up to.

erfweiss · Feb 11, 2007, 10:08 AM // 10:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by the_jos

/E has a couple of nice skills, Glyph of Lesser Energy being the most noticable.
I prefer this skill in most PvE builds I use.

It happened to me, but trading in local chat did not end.
I've seen several groups requesting mesmers in the Gate of Madness mission.
And help of my mesmer has been requested a few times (whisp from PuG leader).
On those occasions they wanted a specific role, so the PuG leader knew what he/she was up to.

Mesmers can be absolutely nasty at the Gate of Madness. I ran mine with full domination (16) and my elite was Spoil Victor. I think I had it at blood magic 9 or 10.

Anyhow, running Empathy and Spoil Victor on Shiro (fast casting), it worked wonders.

pve-er · Feb 11, 2007, 10:22 AM // 10:22

I don't know why people are stubborn with build/team composition. yes we might need some prof to get teh team work, but not all the time. some area is just easy that you don't need specialized team. why not let people try if their build? it might work or not.

Personally I am hardcore as Ele and Sin in PvE. I have been called noob for so many time (because I don't agree to some "elite players" idea. sometime I do see people with creative build work but since I am not the leader a lot of time, I have no right against group of consevative PUG.
I farm FoW a lot of time and consider it not hard. I really like to have a few member that is not the regular team setup (I love my FoW team have 1 tank, 2 monk 2 nuker and I want the other 3 be special. I don't require specific build as long as they know what they are doing. I am excited to have SIn, Mesmer, Rt, while other ppl always ask for barrager, BIP, BR,SS)

To those who only do PvP because they think it is easy. I doubt how many of them really know about PvE. I was in LA get pissed by such jerk who was there begging for a guild. then I try to invite him but he just point at me saying I am noob and wasting his time. dude, if the time is that important, why spend it on a game, go learn some rocket science to save the earth.
people think they are good and laugh at other forgot they were newb once which is sad.
PvE is easy? that is because you are lucky to have a team that don't really need you.
PvE is easy because you can hench it ? that is because ANet and NCSoft did a good job making them smart.
PvE is easy? know how to use some cookie cutter don't mean one is best over the other
peolpe need to learn to remember their bad experience as a newb and be polite and having fun. the new people need other to teach them and give them chance to try.

there is no problem with PUG or fail. if time is that important, go learn rocket science and save the earth. winning isn't everything.

keep in mind, new people need to given chance to try and learn. if everyone are so impatient and self center, the GW will fall and we will lost a place to have fun. (I bet most ppl don't care and simple move on the next game and repeat the cycle)

Rockby Quickfoot · Feb 11, 2007, 04:01 PM // 16:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Captain Dingo

I know what you mean, I've noticed this in what few pickup groups I've been a part of. And if any of them demand to know the exact build I'm using, I just leave the group. My experiences with that is that they then tell me my build could be better and they start criticizing and telling me to bring different skills.

The funny thing about this is 95% of the community hasn't played Mesmer as hardcore and as long as I have, so it's always amusing to hear their suggestions. "omg u dont hav phantasm?"

I'm Domination, sparky, I don't use Phantasm.

My only other issue with pickup groups is, as just hinted to, they never, ever seek Mesmers. Without me sounding too arrogant I hope, I do what I do exceedingly well, and it disheartens me when everyone's just looking for another "tank," "healer," or "nuker." The day I hear someone requesting a Mesmer's assistance will be the day people stop trading in the Local chat.

I agree with this person entirely. My Mesmer is my favorite character and definitely the one I'm best with, but you will NEVER see a PuG asking for a Mesmer. I try to get in PuG if there isn't anyone in my guild/alliance around (or if they're all busy) but it's tough to do that since everyone has to be so hardcore with their elite builds that only have Tanks, Healers, Nukers and a BiP or something.